I had this a whole post written in my head. Random snippets of the weekend and today and Christmas stuff.
When I got home *poof* and away it went.
Now I’m sitting here. Staring at the screen. Wondering what makes people do the things they do. What makes the say the things they say? Are we as human beings hard wired to be fucks? Because sometimes I wonder.
My children’s godparents got a divorce this year. After 17 years of marriage. Husband said one day “I just don’t love you anymore” and wife was devastated. She married young, around 17 or 18. Marriage and husband and kids were all she knew. She never had a career she cared about. Hell, I’m not sure she graduated high school because she had her first child at 15 or 16 and married the next year. About six months after the separation, husband confessed to an affair. Wouldn’t say who, just that he’d had one and it had nothing to do with the way he felt now. Wife was again devastated. Then he moved in with a woman. Again with the devastation. It has been about a year since this all went down, the separation, divorce, news of the affair.
Tonight wife sent me a text message that said “you’ll never guess who husband had the affair with.” She was right because I wanted to think he didn’t really have an affair, that he just said that to make wife mad at him to make her stop clinging to the hope of reconciliation. I wanted to believe he said it because he really didn’t love her anymore but didn’t want her to pine for him and honestly, to make him the asshole made the whole thing seem easier for both of them. They hadn’t been happy for many years before the separation. I just really didn’t peg him as a cheater. I would have NEVER thought he would cheat. Turns out, he’s been having a part time fling with wife’s best friend of 24 years! The very woman who held and consoled my friend during the separation and divorce. I never cared much for her but wife and she met in Jr. High and have been friends ever since. At one point, apparently when the affair started, they lived next to each other in a duplex (twin home). The fling has lasted ten years. Husband and friend both came clean today.
Many emotions went through my head when I heard the news. Disbelief at first, then that weird “no shit” feeling, then that whole “wow, I woulda never guessed that!” feeling, and finally, while talking to wife, that whole “what a fuck” feeling.
You see, I don’t think there is ever an excuse for cheating. If you commit to a person, that committment is the most important thing ever. Period. There can and never will be a justification for cheating as far as I’m concerned. I know plenty of people who’ve cheated, some the cheater, some the cheatee. I don’t hate them, I don’t not want to be friends with them, I simply don’t support their decision and I cannot be an ear when their world falls apart. (oh, and I would never date or marry them).
What I still don’t understand is what makes a person cheat? Friends have said that it “just happened” or that they didn’t mean for it to happen. I call bullshit. They wouldn’t have been there if they didn’t mean for something to happen. Cheaters to me are one level above child abusers. I can honestly say that I would never cheat. I’ve been presented with the opportunity. I could have in the past. I didn’t. I wasn’t even married yet, this is back when I was just dating but still, I was committed to the person I was with. Period. End of Story. That didn’t stop my first fiance from cheating on me. I am certain that given the chance, my husband would cheat on me. Especially if he thought he wouldn’t get caught, he would be all fucking over it. But why? Is it the thrill? Is it the danger of getting caught? Is it the power or control?
I just don’t understand. It makes me sad really. Because when a person cheats, their actions have a ripple effect. So many people are affected by the actions of a cheater, and that one act, that the cheater thinks only effects him/her, in reality, hurts everyone down the line.
Honestly, if you think you need to cheat, leave the person you’re with first. (Wo)man up and fucking walk away before you do it. Show some respect for the person who believes in and trusts and loves you.
(this is not directed at anyone in the blogosphere. I feel bad that my friend keeps trying to get on with her life only to be constantly reminded of the past and then to find out a week before Christmas that her husband AND her best friend were fucking cunts. Now, I’m in a shitty mood)
I’m not playing Devil’s advocate, but I truly believe that in most cases, adultery is a symptom, not a cause. MOST cases. Yes, some people are just sociopathic assholes who want to see what they can get away with.
ReplyDeleteBut…in the cases that I have seen amongst people I know, the marriage was in trouble first and then the cheating began. Imagine if your husband was a controlling asshole who verbally abused you, but you believed in marriage and didn’t want to hurt your children by getting a divorce. Then a nice guy starts being nice to you. He tells you that you are pretty. He laughs at your jokes. He doesn’t talk down to you. It wouldn’t be a huge stretch to see how someone in that situation would fall into an affair.
I agree…people should get the hell out BEFORE they cheat. But the person I describe above is an amalgam of several of my friends…one of whom did cheat. And she is still my friend. I don’t agree with her choice…but I love her as a friend and no matter what other people say, I have her back.
What you said.
ReplyDeleteDi, I think you’re making and/or accepting excuses. Your friends are unfaithful. Period. Cheating is very telling of a person’s morality. I would not be friends with your friends…including the whiner whose husband is a big giant meanie maker. She is a dumb bitch to stay with him…there is no for the sake of the kids going on there when the kids are seeing abuse.
I agree with Miss Ann. And what Di said, if I had a friend in that bad situation, she should leave her husband first. She SHOULD leave while she’s young and can start over and hey, look! Other men find you interesting, it won’t be so bad being single. And the abusing husband, I bet if he found his wife cheating, it would get bad. People get KILLED over affairs of the heart.
ReplyDeleteBut thses two fucktards, WHY did they tell your friend everything and just make it MORE hurtful? That’s a mind-fuck, 10 YEARS! I’m guessing, maybe they thought by finally being “honest” ~gag~ they would make THEMSELVES feel better? They SHOULD have just shut up and said they “suddenly” fell in love.
Actually they SHOULD be fucking shot in the heads.
(that thing I said about “People get killed” over this shit.)
As usual, you’re on the money, honey. Have to agree with you all the way. The very worst part of cheating is the damage is does to your own character or self-worth or whatever you want to call it. That’s even more destructive than the pain you cause to the person you made a commitment to. Because those commitments are made both to YOURSELF and your partner, so when you cheat, you cheat both parties. And then you have to live with that decision. And that cheapens you, no matter how you cut it. People who can’t keep commitments they make to themselves are weak, useless humans. They make especially bad spouses and parents.
ReplyDeleteDi - I believe in my marriage too. The last thing I’d ever want is a divorce. I think part of the problem with our society is that many people get married with the idea that if it doesn?t work out they can leave. Marriage is seen as disposable. However, I think that my kids growing up in a situation where they will eventually find bad behavior to be acceptable and/or growing up to believe they do not deserve to be treated better is far more harmful to them long term than getting out early on.
ReplyDeleteAND if a marriage is in bad shape to start with, then walk away because it is impossible to work on a problem when both parties don’t want too (and a cheater doesn?t want too because he/she is getting what they are lacking so the situation seems tolerable.
I can see where situations come up but again, grow a fucking backbone and walk away before you do something you?ll regret.
I have lost all respect for the people I?ve ever known who cheated. Doesn?t mean I hate them or don?t even still love some of them, I just don?t respect the decisions they made.
Oh Annie. They aren’t in love. Apparently, they were just fuck buddies on occasion. My friend got a text message from husband’s current fiance (the chick he moved in with) who spilled her guts. Friend thought she was starting shit so she didn?t respond to the text. Then friend?s daughter called and was crying that dad just confessed. So friend called best friend who at first denied, then after husband admitted, friend admitted and said, get this, ?I hope this doesn?t ruin our friendship!? Friend said ?the only reason you?re alive is because it?s illegal to kill you.?
ReplyDeleteAnd I said the exact same thing, why tell her now? Almost a year later AND a week before Christmas? I swear to god times like this I fucking hate people.
What a bunch of slimy cunts.
I thought for a while about responding to this post. I’ve been on both sides, I’ve cheated and I’ve been cheated on and I’ve had an affair.
ReplyDeleteI really can’t say why I cheated, other than a physical attraction (and alcohol) and I believe that was the same reason my now EX cheated on me. I’d need to write a book to put down all my thoughts, but I’ll try.
First off, EX and I should of never married, we were never commited to each other from the start. It was pretty much a relationship of convenience on both our parts and he cheated 3/4 months into it. WHY we stayed together and eventually married neither of us knows. Thankfully 23 years later and 4 separations later (one for almost 2 years) we have finally parted permanently. We are still friends, spend time together on occasion and still chat on the phone.
My hubby now and I had an affair. Yes, it filtered down the line to his family and no, it wasn’t right and I’m not going to tell you people didn’t get hurt, including us, BUT, when you meet the person of your dreams (on both sides) and one of you is in an unhappy marriage of convenience (on her part) also, what do you do?
His EX married him to get away from her father (and told him so), didn’t love him (and told him so), married him only to have kids and to not have to work (and told him so), what would you think? How would you handle it?
We’ve been together for almost 6 years, married for almost 4 and are deliriously happy. Was what we did wrong? Of course! BUT, what she did to him, wasn’t that wrong also?
I guess what I’m saying is, I would NEVER in another lifetime of had an affair with a married man, much less him leave her for me. I even stopped being friends with people that did, but until you’ve/I’d walked in that persons shoes, you have NO idea what you’d do, especially if the circumstances were similiar to ours.
Like I said, I could write a book. There are loads and tons of unwritten things that happened for us to get here, obviously. But “I” don’t think anyone can say they would never ever do something, cause you just don’t know, we certainly didn’t.
As far as a bad spouse or parent, I’m a great spouse to my hubby and is hubby a great spouse to me (but then we each found our dream person). He is also a fantastic father to his children!
Do anything you have too to make yourself feel better but you’re not going to convince me that you had no choice and the spouse was ‘wrong’ because she married him for wrong reasons…she told him that. He had the opportunity to leave at that point in time.
ReplyDeleteI have a friend who was fucking a married man. We talked about it once. I told her exactly how I felt about what she was doing but she was still my friend. I did not dump her for what she was doing. It wasn’t affecting me.
I can certaoinly judge cheaters. I spent several years in a shitty relationship with a guy who cheated. I did not cheat though I guess you could say since he was I had a ‘free pass.’ No, eventually I just wised up and dumped his idiot ass.
You choose to stay married. You choose to cheat. You choose to be moral and lie in the bed you made or get the fuck out.
Today, as easy as divorce is, there is no fucking excuse for infidelity.
But I’m perfectly ok with those who choose to fool themselves into believing what they do/did is excusable.
I don’t respect people who cheat. Period. And that includes my friend. She ended up getting out of that relationship and I have no respect for what she did but I still like her. 17 years is a long time to be someone’s friend and what she did wasn’t enough to end our friendship.
She got herpes from that relationship. I guess karma got her in the end.
The part of cheating that is truly loathesome is the dishonesty. It’s not that you are having sex with some other person, though that sure does sting, emotionally speaking.
ReplyDeleteIt’s that you don’t even have enough respect or regard for your spouse to give them the chance to opt out. The cheater is making all sorts of decisions that impact the other person without the guts to stand behind those choices. Cheating is fucking repulsive.
I know that I would never cheat. I am not hard wired for that type of activity. I would feel so guilty and bad that I wouldn’t put myself in that position. I know this about myself and I can say NEVER. When I took my vows, I knew what I was signing up for. I accepted that and live those words daily. Up until two years ago, I would have said the same about my husband. I don’t know that anymore. I don’t think he has cheated. Yet. However, if opportunity knocked?
ReplyDeleteWhat I do know about my friends and other people I’ve known is this: EVERY person I know, cheater or cheatee, they have the same issues in their current relationship. Suspicion. I could tell stories upon stories and as an observer, I always have the same question: If you are with a person who is/was cheating (especially if they cheated with you), how can you have any trust, comfort or expectation that they will not eventually cheat on you?
I’m not going to go there on the “should people cheat” thing - because obviously no one SHOULD. It obviously happens.
ReplyDeleteBUT - having been cheated on, my heart goes out to your friend. A 10 year affair I think would hurt even worse than a one time “oops” - or what the hell ever. The idea of being lied to for so long, God she’s got to be questioning everything she thought she KNEW to be true for the last 17+ years.
Merry frickin’ Christmas, eh?
He did leave when she told him all those things. The only thing was, she didn’t tell him till she found out about me. She made his life hell for years and he could never figure out why. It was because of the reasons she married him, that she didn’t love him or want to be with him.
ReplyDeleteTrust me, I’m not making excuses or making myself feel better, I’m just telling it like it is/was.
I’m not hardwired to cheat either and never thought I would, it just happened. Would I cheat again, never!
But you are correct most people think they can just leave the marriage if it doesn’t work out. Like I said, I could write an entire book on this subject. Both of my experiences with my EX and my hubby with his EX and he and him.
I worked for YEARS trying to get the EX to make our marriage work, finally, I just kicked his ass out!!! I got sick to death of having a one-sided relationship. Yes, we (read = I mostely) went to couseling severly times. The last counselor really worked for me. She gave me insight I had never received before and that was how I made the very difficult decision to end that relationship.
People make some really stupid choices and then everyone gets hurt. It’s too bad that Christmas time becomes a source of pain rather than joy.
ReplyDeletehttp://organizeddoodles.blogspot.com/
I just don’t “get” cheating. I guess it isn’t in me to do it. Oh sure, I flirt…Doug flirts…but we don’t like MEAN it when we flirt….does that make sense?
ReplyDeleteAnyway, ickness…about the friend. How devastating it must be. God.
Used to be wrote:
ReplyDeleteIf you are with a person who is/was cheating (especially if they cheated with you), how can you have any trust, comfort or expectation that they will not eventually cheat on you?
You can’t. That’s why so many marriages end after an affair. Beyond that, the cheater goes on about his/her merry way, but the spouse who has been cheated on struggles to heal for years afterwards, to learn how to trust again and not worry about infidelity in future relationships.
been there, done that.
I’m digging out from a hole in the ground because I cheated on my husband six years ago. The other man was lethal. I got what I deserved when my husband threw me out of the house, changed the locks and closed the bank account.
ReplyDeleteHe took the kids away from me and I didn’t see them for a year.
I was homeless and broke.
Then I lived with the “other” man. He was emotionally abusive. It was a living hell.
It’s been an uphill battle ever since and it’s taken years to work it all out…and it’s still not completely there.
Many of my friends lost respect for me…they walked away in disgust. I can count on one hand the friends who I can call true friends, who no matter what…have my back.
It is what it is. I live with what I did, I take accountability and I take shit from people who think I’m an asshole for cheating on my husband in the first place.
I know now it was a stupid choice. I’m not a bad person because I made a bad decision though.
I was thinking deeply about this post, as I too was married for 17 years. I got cancer in the last year and my husband, because of where the tumour was situated, never touched me sexually again. I fell in a love with a guy who convinced me that he found me beautiful and attractive but I didn’t sleep with him until I left my husband and told him first.
ReplyDeleteMy friends wouldn’t speak to me; my family disowned me. I was incredibly unhappy and really, still I am. I was un happy int he marriage, the new guy changed his mind and I was left with nothing and nobody to talk it over with.
I would actually hate to be friends with you. A true friend will just listen and understand things are not always as cut and dried as they seem. Listening is all I ever needed.
I wonder personally whether your friends would always be there for you, no matter what. If they are, well, then you are luckier than you deserve, but I suspect your friendships are based on a more superficial level on both sides, which is fine.
Mine weren’t at least from my perspective, which is why it hurt so much. I attempted suicide once and have not yet recovered from the awful trauma of it.
I don’t know what happened with your friends, Rexy. I cannot image abandoning a friend of mine no matter what.
ReplyDeleteI don’t have to like what a person does to keep liking them. It is, however, incredibly easy to lose respect for and dislike people who you already feel marginal about.
This is a moral issue and you did the moral thing so i don’t know why you think any of us are referring to someone like you.
Regardless, are you luckier than you deserve? Because honey, that’s an incredibly ignorant thing to say when you seem to be preaching about judgements.
And sadly, it appears your friends were poorly chosen as they seem to be superficial. Your friendships were dependent upon your marital status.
Rexy, who are you talking to?
ReplyDeleteIf you are addressing me, fine. But lets get a few things straight.
I don’t judge my friends, but I certainly opine and make judgments about their actions. Doesn’t mean I cannot or do not still love them. In fact, the idea that adults can disagree and remain friends is very telling of any relationship.
I’m still friends with both of those I refer to in this post. They’re my daughter’s god parents. Just because he was fucking stupid doesn’t mean I have to cut off all contact.
Finally, I don’t really care if my friends would be there or not, because I don’t pick my friends based upon the chance they might be around if I needed them. I have friends because I want to be friends with them and because I am there when they need me. If they are there for me in return, then they are a real friend. Seems pretty simple to me.
If your friends left you, that is sad, but they obviously weren’t your friends in the first place. If you are still traumatized, I suggest counseling to help you get back on your feet and to a point where you realize that you can be a strong woman because of who you are, not who your friends are.